You can buy gearbox parts at:
http://www.axel-augustin.de/shop2/Fiat-Professional-/Fiat-Ducato-Typ-280/290-2-5-TD-bis-Bj-94/Geriebedichtsaetze-Getriebe-Getriebeteile-Tachowellen/Getriebeteile-5-Gang:::3_173_77355_77364.html
This company has very modest packaging costs.
The change of the fith gear parts is rather easy to do without removing the gearbox!
Success,
Bert
Hi Bert,
Thanks for the link. A number of people have told me that the repair is fairly easy and with labour charges being expensive I’d like to consider doing the job myself but the idea scares me a little. Is it really that easy to do?
Gary
Hi Gary K,
Thanks for the comment. I’d like to think a change of gearbox oil would fix my problem and I might try it this week but somehow I doubt it will be that easy. I have no noises from the gearbox and even if I hold it in 5th manually for a while it will not stay and will jump out immediately. Do you happen to know the name of the garage in Luton? I might call them to see what the likely price would be to fix the problem.
I might also Google some more to see if others have been able to fix this problem just by going a gearbox oil change.
Thanks and I will update people with the outcome soon.
All the best
Gary B
If you want the job done for you try Ouse Valley Autos in Warboys near Huntingdon.
http://www.fowl.org.uk/directorydetails/directorypages/Sponsors/ouse%20valley%20090221.htm
They are independent Fiat Specialists and Fiat main dealer trained.
They have done the job lots of times and are advocates of keeping the box slightly overfilled to ensure the gears get adequate lubrication.
Hi Steve,
Thanks for the suggestion, I will give them a call later to see what the likely cost will be and their hourly labour rate. It’s a hard one to decide who to send it to, the cost of the diesel is not cheap with only 4 gears, maybe I need to plan a visit to Cambridge to kill 2 birds with 1 stone.
Thanks again
Gary
Re 5th gear.
I have an Autotrail Chyenne, had the problem. There is a fix kit and my usual mechanic did the job well over a year ago, no problems since. He charged under £200.
Ted
Hi Ted,
Thanks for the comment and really interested to know more. How much was the kit? Do you have a part number for the kit? Where was your mechanic based? I’m keen to get this fixed very soon.
All the best
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond
Hi Ted I also have an Autotrail Cheyenne its a 2001 model but my problem is with 3rd gear grinding when going in or out of gear, Iv had it repaired a couple of months ago they said they’d replaced the 3rd gear which obviously they hav’nt so now im going through trading standards to take these cowboys to court, (I wont say the name of the garage involved until we have been to court) but now im looking for somebody with a good repututation to repair it again, any help would be appreciated. Cheers
Regular servicing is the key,the older the motor the more often you service it,and do it yourself.Check your hand books use the recommended oils ect. Change your anti-freeze just a couple of months before you need too,out off date coolant rusts the engine from inside out and nackers the pump.I was quoted £800 for a ECU part for my car(not Fiat) I refused point blank,i got a cll the next day telling me the company would do it for £500,I again refused point blank.2days later another call telling me the company would do it for £180,I accepted,it pays to let dealers know firmly you won’t pay extortionate prices.
Hi Fred thanks for the comment. I do much less mileage these days but mine is certainly due a service based on how long ago since I did the last one. I did the oil and filter change myself last time but I also have a new fuel filter that I want to fit and following your comment I think it would be a good time to change the coolant.
I know what you mean about quotes from garages that you just don’t believe. They will always be more expensive due to their overheads like premises but I even don’t trust some of the quotes given by mobile mechanics. The problem with the Fiat 5th gear is a classic example. I’ve read some stories of owners being told the whole gearbox has to be changed, and this is an overseas Fiat dealer telling them this! Another UK owner called Garry repaired it himself and created a document and some images for others who wanted to try the repair themselves. He says it’s a couple of hours to repair but one of the companies I was recommended to contact within the comments have quoted me 4 1/2 hours labour and a total bill well in excess of £800.00 so who do you believe?
There is no way I’ll pay £800.00 for a fault I believe is a Fiat problem due to badly manufactured gearbox. I’m hoping to find some honest, reliable mobile mechanic who has done this job before and will charge an honest rate.
In the meantime I won’t be driving it anywhere long distance.
If anyone knows a mechanic that they can honestly recommend please get in touch.
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond
Hi Gary,
Did Ted ever get back to you with the kit price and where his mechanic is based? Also did you contact the Warboys garage? Am over from Spain until the 29th of April and this problem developed today on my 1995 Ducato based Hymer motorhome!
Hi Tony,
Sorry for few days delay in reply. I’m still waiting to do this repair but others have kindly helped me with information. It seems buying the part from Peugeot is cheaper than Fiat, the Peugeot part number is 2344C9 and this part costs between £150.00 and £200.00. Fiat wanted over £250.00.
The best place from all the advice I’ve been given to do the job is Transmission Services in Guildford who put labour at between two and three hours. They have done this job many times before and slightly overfill the gearbox when replacing the part. Apparently you don’t also need to buy the synchro and this part can be reversed. You will find huge variations in quotes so if you plan on repair in Europe make them aware you know what is involved so they don’t try and overcharge on labour or buy extra parts you don’t need.
Good luck.
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond
Hi Gary,
I am over for Spain until the 29th of April, visiting family and friends, and therefore needed to get it sorted asap (didnt fancy long drives either here or going back to Spain in 4th!). Did a lot of research (tried Ouse Valley as you did and had to laugh!), and phoned various places along my intended route from Huntingdon, to Northampton, to Shropshire, to Morecambe, to York, to Leeds, and then back out of the country via Dover. I ended up getting it done last Thursday by A1 Gearboxes of Eaton Socon, St Neots, Cambs (http://www.a1gearboxes.co.uk/). Steve from here was the only one when I explained the vehicle and problem and asked for a price, who gave me an instant response. The job took 2 hours to do, including a before and after road test to confirm the problem, and cost what he said £350+ V.A.T. They showed me the changed items afterwards, and also overfilled the gearbox. I did have some tools with me, so could probably have done it myself somewhere along the line, but with the cost of parts and the knowledge of knowing that this was something they have done many times in the past, I was quite happy to get it done professionally (was quoted upto £1400 and needing the vehicle for 4 days elsewhere) at that price. I also elected not to have the ‘ratio change’ upgrade, as I am quite happy with the fuel economy/maximum speed attainable – I have owned and driven the vehicle from purchasing it in Germany at 18000 miles to its current 125000 miles. Best of luck.
Tony O
Anybody know why my 2005 fiat ducato (23000 mls) suddenly loses power in 5th gear and feels like its goin to stall, yet when i lay off the revs or drop down to 4th it picks back up, doesnt happen all the time but its gettin more regular
Hi Ken,
No sorry not the same problem as my 5th gear issue but if anyone reading has heard of this before please let Ken or I know your thoughts.
Hope you get it sorted.
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond
hi i had the 5th gear issue, once it goes you need to change it the whole gear set up is about £670 i modified the end casing and got a filler brazed on it to make filling gearbox easier i added molyslip to gear oil to ensure there will always be lubrication in the 5th gear and also check it every 1000 miles.
its an easy fix replacing the gear .
good luck
The reason the 5th gear fails is lack of lubrication to the 5th gear, the oil having to pass through the 4 speed casing bearing. The solution when fitting a new 5th gear is to drill holes through the bottom of the casing to equalise the oil level in the 4 speed casing and the 5th gear extension casting.
Over filling a little if unmodified is unlikely to improve lubrication as it still has to pass through the bearing. Gearbox molyslip would help.
Do not over work 5th gear. Change down early and keep the revs up.
Hi Keith,
Thanks for the comment. It seems clear that this is a design fault and despite the high number of failures Fiat don’t want to admit any liability that the design is the issue. Certainly I would advise anyone buying a Ducato based motorhome to be wary of this and keeps revs high when changing up to 5th gear. I wish I knew of this problem when I bought mine as my natural driving style is quite conservative ‘revs’ wise.
Thanks for the insight. I’m sure the others who find this blog after 5th gear problems appreciate it too.
All the best
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond
Hi Gary I own an auto trail apache Fiat Ducato Im having problems with the 3rd gear making a crunching noise when you change up or down. The van is 2009 had it from new and its only done just under 8000 miles Its out of warranty but spoke to Fiat at the motorhome show they suggested taking it into a local dealership which we did they want to change me £875 to strip gear box down to find out IF there is a problem with no guarantee of any financial riemburstment from Fiat which I think stinks anyone else had this problem? I was going to buy a new motorhome in the spring but I think I might change my mind after reading your blog/forum
Hi Christine. Sorry to hear about your problem with 3rd gear. Since yours is a much newer motorhome it does not sound like the famous 5th gear problem which was an issue on older Fiat Ducato motorhomes. I do think Fiat are offering poor service in your case and in the case of the 5th gear issue. If the gearbox is fit for purpose then those that have the 5th gear repaired would not overfill the gearbox with oil and change their driving style to get around what is essentially a design flaw.
Hopefully someone reading this will have some idea what it might be. I can certainly understand why you don’t want to buy another new motorhome that is based on a Fiat when they are trying to fleece you over £875.00 on a motorhome that has done less than 8000 miles, regardless of how many years old it is. However you do need to get it fixed and so if the warranty has expired anyway don’t put any money in Fiat UK’s pockets, get an independent gearbox specialist to look at it. In my opinion Fiat know there is an issue with the gearbox on some models and rather than feel ashamed and try to fix the problem they try to profit from it. A case in point is the 5th gear on my Ducato which is the same part as used by Citroen and Peugeot. Why were Fiat charging much more for the same part than Peugeot? Naturally I bought my 5th gear from Peugeot to save money and also avoid Fiat from profiting in any way.
If you like motorhoming then you should not let this put you off. By all means become wary and educate yourself about issues with various base vehicles. For example I would consider buying a Fiat Ducato based vehicle again but I would overfill the gearbox and ensure I did not change up to 5th until revs were high and not at all uphill. Many vehicles have a weak point but I just wish manufacturers and dealers were more honest about these.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do. I know I would be furious in your position being the first and only owner of the vehicle with such a low mileage.
All the best
Gary
The Motorhome Vagabond